Hi all,
Last week we established why we ask the Father in prayer rather than Jesus or the Holy Spirit. The question then naturally arises; "How can I fellowship with the Lord, or with the Holy Spirit?"
What the NT says about 'fellowship' with the Father, Lord, or Holy Spirit
"God is faithful, who has called you into the fellowship of His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord." I Corinthians 1: 9
"Therefore if there is any encouragement in Christ, any comfort in love, if you have known the fellowship of the Spirit..." Philippians 2:1
"That which we have seen and heard we share with you, that you also may have fellowship with us: And truly our fellowship is with the Father, and which His Son the Lord Jesus Christ." I John 1: 3
These are the verses in the New Testament that speak directly of fellowship with the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. And there are no prayers to the Holy Spirit. That's it, in spite of the common teaching about talking to the Holy Spirit, in spite of the many services that open with inviting the Holy Spirit's presence to be there (He is already there, for Christ is in every believer and He is there He said where 2 or 3 are gathered - so the prayer is in error).
Just think about all that people believe is God about the Holy Spirit, but is not. And because He is truth, He cannot go into error with them, thus leading to much frustration in the body of Christ about not feeling or sensing or hearing the Spirit, all because they've believed the wrong things of Him and are therefore looking in all the wrong places.
If a person wants to pray to the Spirit the Father won't stop them, but if they want the most of their time and fellowship with the Father and Son, if a person wants to be accurate in prayers, they have to adapt to what scripture actually says rather than what a favorite TV preacher, author, or pastor says. The words of Jesus and Paul have to carry more weight with us than a modern preacher or teacher or book.
Slight detour - defining the unpardonable sin
All we know of the Father or Lord is through the Holy Spirit. Scripture Paul says is 'inspired' and Peter says, was written by men who were 'moved by the Holy Spirit' (II Timothy 3: 16, II Peter 1: 21). From scripture to our fellowship with Him; it is via the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is THE link with God on the earth.
Therefore the unpardonable sin is to reject (blaspheme) the Holy Spirit. He is the One on earth offering salvation. Jesus told Nicodemus in their private night time conversation in John 3: 5-8, a person must be born by the Spirit to enter the kingdom of God. If a person rejects the Holy Spirit's work of bringing salvation, they are lost. Jesus died for others, not for Himself, so that is the 1 sin of rejecting Jesus is the only one not covered by the cross.
Jesus was warning the religious leaders in Matthew 12: 24-32 who said He cast out demons by the power of Satan, while Jesus said He did it by the Spirit of God. That act of attributing the works of God (which is done by the Holy Spirit) to the devil is to walk dangerously close to the unpardonable sin, for they were rejecting the work of the Spirit, the Agent of salvation.
Back to the subject
Our Father is in heaven. Jesus ascended to heaven and is in the realm of the Spirit where He is until He physically manifests at His return. If you or I see Him or sense His presence, He is there in the Spirit realm - not a hologram, not a reasonable facsimile of the Lord - but it is the Lord Himself.
Our eyes can be opened to His realm, and in the Spirit realm we sense or see or hear Him through the Holy Spirit. The apostle John stated in Revelation 1: 10 "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard a voice behind me..." He saw the Lord, via the Holy Spirit, his eyes opened to His realm.
It is the Spirit that is the link between heaven and earth and the One in ministry on the earth today - He reports accurately as the Spirit of Truth, all that He hears from the Father or Lord for us.
Jesus said, "I have many things to say to you (to the disciples), but you can't receive them now. However when He, the Spirit of Truth has come, He will speak to you and guide you into all truth, for the Holy Spirit speaks nothing of Himself, but whatever He hears, that is what He speaks, and He will show you things to come." John 16: 12-13.
Jesus said He would speak 'many things' to them, through the Holy Spirit after He has come - which was at Pentecost. So if the Lord talks to you or me today, it is through the Holy Spirit. As Paul said, the Holy Spirt searches the Father to see what the Father has provided for us. I Corinthians 2: 9-12
Another detour, but as long as we are clearing up confusion and killing off traditions of men, why stop now?
I might take a slight detour to add that Paul indicated that it is also possible for believers to have fellowship with demons, for he says in I Corinthians 10: 20-22: "But I say, that the things the Gentiles (non-believers) sacrifice to, they sacrifice to demons and not to God. I don't want you to have fellowship with demons. You can't drink the cup of the Lord and also the cup of devils (the practice of a 'toast' sacrifice to a god)."
Paul was referring to the teaching of some that you could be a 'good Christian' while also making sacrifices to demons in the pagan temples, which was common for the ratifying of business contracts. I cover this in my 'Jezebel' series for this teaching was the sin of the woman the Lord nicknamed Jezebel in Revelation 2:20. Her city, Thyatira, was the center for labor unions (guilds) in the Roman Empire. For a person to buy or sell any wholesale product or even real estate meant confirming the contract by an offering to the god or goddess of that union and having sex with the temple prostitute. She taught you could be a follower of Jesus while giving in to such practices, for which she was strongly rebuked by the Lord. Get the series if you want to study it in more detail.
The conclusion is that yes, it is possible for Christians to have and know demons or Paul would not have said "I don't want you to have fellowship with demons." In fact in my 44+ years of walking with the Father I've cast more demons out of believers than unbelievers. They cannot inhabit a Christian's spirit, but can oppress their mind and/or body.
But a Christian can also merely 'fellowship' with demons as Paul said, by dabbling in occasional sin, much as offering sacrifices to a god or goddess to close a business deal or buy/sell a house and then have sex with the temple prostitute would be an occasional thing in Paul's time. It would be like today the man or woman with the occasional porn habit, or one who goes to clubs and such where they know are people and atmosphere that has demons. Or any believer who truly loves God but just keeps this little habit of the flesh entertained every so often. They fellowship with demons every now and then.
They have fellowship with the demonic in a temporary way, then ask to be forgiven and go on with their Christian life. Paul was talking to believers about stopping their sacrifices to the gods and goddesses and sex with prostitutes. Remember, these Corinthians were charismatic, zealous for God believers, but in many ways deeply flawed. But they were growing in Christ - Paul's longest communication with any church is I and II Corinthians - their flaws in life yet acceptance by the Lord. Paul told them they would make the rapture in I Corinthians 15, and that they would rule over the world and angels in the age to come in I Corinthians 6:2, and their strife and envy was wood, hay and stubble, that would be burned in judgement in I Corinthians 3: 1-15, provides hope for us today!
The word 'fellowship' means 'to have in common', 'to participate in common with', and is intended for believers in fellowship with the Lord. But some Christian can also have a common agreement with demons, or fellowship as Paul wrote.
I see these detours though needed, took me away from the subject of how to actually fellowship with the Father, Lord, and Holy Spirit and how to tell the difference between them. It made this week's 'Thoughts' extra long - I apologize. I promise to do that next week....until then, blessings!
John Fenn
www.cwowi.org and email me at [email protected]
Last week we established why we ask the Father in prayer rather than Jesus or the Holy Spirit. The question then naturally arises; "How can I fellowship with the Lord, or with the Holy Spirit?"
What the NT says about 'fellowship' with the Father, Lord, or Holy Spirit
"God is faithful, who has called you into the fellowship of His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord." I Corinthians 1: 9
"Therefore if there is any encouragement in Christ, any comfort in love, if you have known the fellowship of the Spirit..." Philippians 2:1
"That which we have seen and heard we share with you, that you also may have fellowship with us: And truly our fellowship is with the Father, and which His Son the Lord Jesus Christ." I John 1: 3
These are the verses in the New Testament that speak directly of fellowship with the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. And there are no prayers to the Holy Spirit. That's it, in spite of the common teaching about talking to the Holy Spirit, in spite of the many services that open with inviting the Holy Spirit's presence to be there (He is already there, for Christ is in every believer and He is there He said where 2 or 3 are gathered - so the prayer is in error).
Just think about all that people believe is God about the Holy Spirit, but is not. And because He is truth, He cannot go into error with them, thus leading to much frustration in the body of Christ about not feeling or sensing or hearing the Spirit, all because they've believed the wrong things of Him and are therefore looking in all the wrong places.
If a person wants to pray to the Spirit the Father won't stop them, but if they want the most of their time and fellowship with the Father and Son, if a person wants to be accurate in prayers, they have to adapt to what scripture actually says rather than what a favorite TV preacher, author, or pastor says. The words of Jesus and Paul have to carry more weight with us than a modern preacher or teacher or book.
Slight detour - defining the unpardonable sin
All we know of the Father or Lord is through the Holy Spirit. Scripture Paul says is 'inspired' and Peter says, was written by men who were 'moved by the Holy Spirit' (II Timothy 3: 16, II Peter 1: 21). From scripture to our fellowship with Him; it is via the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is THE link with God on the earth.
Therefore the unpardonable sin is to reject (blaspheme) the Holy Spirit. He is the One on earth offering salvation. Jesus told Nicodemus in their private night time conversation in John 3: 5-8, a person must be born by the Spirit to enter the kingdom of God. If a person rejects the Holy Spirit's work of bringing salvation, they are lost. Jesus died for others, not for Himself, so that is the 1 sin of rejecting Jesus is the only one not covered by the cross.
Jesus was warning the religious leaders in Matthew 12: 24-32 who said He cast out demons by the power of Satan, while Jesus said He did it by the Spirit of God. That act of attributing the works of God (which is done by the Holy Spirit) to the devil is to walk dangerously close to the unpardonable sin, for they were rejecting the work of the Spirit, the Agent of salvation.
Back to the subject
Our Father is in heaven. Jesus ascended to heaven and is in the realm of the Spirit where He is until He physically manifests at His return. If you or I see Him or sense His presence, He is there in the Spirit realm - not a hologram, not a reasonable facsimile of the Lord - but it is the Lord Himself.
Our eyes can be opened to His realm, and in the Spirit realm we sense or see or hear Him through the Holy Spirit. The apostle John stated in Revelation 1: 10 "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard a voice behind me..." He saw the Lord, via the Holy Spirit, his eyes opened to His realm.
It is the Spirit that is the link between heaven and earth and the One in ministry on the earth today - He reports accurately as the Spirit of Truth, all that He hears from the Father or Lord for us.
Jesus said, "I have many things to say to you (to the disciples), but you can't receive them now. However when He, the Spirit of Truth has come, He will speak to you and guide you into all truth, for the Holy Spirit speaks nothing of Himself, but whatever He hears, that is what He speaks, and He will show you things to come." John 16: 12-13.
Jesus said He would speak 'many things' to them, through the Holy Spirit after He has come - which was at Pentecost. So if the Lord talks to you or me today, it is through the Holy Spirit. As Paul said, the Holy Spirt searches the Father to see what the Father has provided for us. I Corinthians 2: 9-12
Another detour, but as long as we are clearing up confusion and killing off traditions of men, why stop now?
I might take a slight detour to add that Paul indicated that it is also possible for believers to have fellowship with demons, for he says in I Corinthians 10: 20-22: "But I say, that the things the Gentiles (non-believers) sacrifice to, they sacrifice to demons and not to God. I don't want you to have fellowship with demons. You can't drink the cup of the Lord and also the cup of devils (the practice of a 'toast' sacrifice to a god)."
Paul was referring to the teaching of some that you could be a 'good Christian' while also making sacrifices to demons in the pagan temples, which was common for the ratifying of business contracts. I cover this in my 'Jezebel' series for this teaching was the sin of the woman the Lord nicknamed Jezebel in Revelation 2:20. Her city, Thyatira, was the center for labor unions (guilds) in the Roman Empire. For a person to buy or sell any wholesale product or even real estate meant confirming the contract by an offering to the god or goddess of that union and having sex with the temple prostitute. She taught you could be a follower of Jesus while giving in to such practices, for which she was strongly rebuked by the Lord. Get the series if you want to study it in more detail.
The conclusion is that yes, it is possible for Christians to have and know demons or Paul would not have said "I don't want you to have fellowship with demons." In fact in my 44+ years of walking with the Father I've cast more demons out of believers than unbelievers. They cannot inhabit a Christian's spirit, but can oppress their mind and/or body.
But a Christian can also merely 'fellowship' with demons as Paul said, by dabbling in occasional sin, much as offering sacrifices to a god or goddess to close a business deal or buy/sell a house and then have sex with the temple prostitute would be an occasional thing in Paul's time. It would be like today the man or woman with the occasional porn habit, or one who goes to clubs and such where they know are people and atmosphere that has demons. Or any believer who truly loves God but just keeps this little habit of the flesh entertained every so often. They fellowship with demons every now and then.
They have fellowship with the demonic in a temporary way, then ask to be forgiven and go on with their Christian life. Paul was talking to believers about stopping their sacrifices to the gods and goddesses and sex with prostitutes. Remember, these Corinthians were charismatic, zealous for God believers, but in many ways deeply flawed. But they were growing in Christ - Paul's longest communication with any church is I and II Corinthians - their flaws in life yet acceptance by the Lord. Paul told them they would make the rapture in I Corinthians 15, and that they would rule over the world and angels in the age to come in I Corinthians 6:2, and their strife and envy was wood, hay and stubble, that would be burned in judgement in I Corinthians 3: 1-15, provides hope for us today!
The word 'fellowship' means 'to have in common', 'to participate in common with', and is intended for believers in fellowship with the Lord. But some Christian can also have a common agreement with demons, or fellowship as Paul wrote.
I see these detours though needed, took me away from the subject of how to actually fellowship with the Father, Lord, and Holy Spirit and how to tell the difference between them. It made this week's 'Thoughts' extra long - I apologize. I promise to do that next week....until then, blessings!
John Fenn
www.cwowi.org and email me at [email protected]
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