Hi all,
There is great confusion about Seers, prophets, prophecy, personal prophecy. In this part 1 I'll share how we can know people by their spirit - and the troubles it can cause.
Attraction to one's spirit
"From this point on I will not know a person by man's standards, (but by the spirit), though we knew Christ once in the flesh, but no more, we know Him by the Spirit. For if anyone is in Christ he is a new creation. Old things are gone, behold, all things are new and all things are of God." II Corinthians 5: 16-17.
In the world we recognize or give honor or know a person according to the standards of the world: Education, economics, job held, wealth and so on. In Christ there is but one standard: Being born again. Earthly measurements of knowing someone are secondary, which is why Paul said from this point on he won't know a person according to worldly standards, but by the Spirit.
Much damage has been done by people confused about this New Testament reality of knowing people by their spirit. Many a woman has thrown herself at a minister because her spirit identifies with some of the gifts in his spirit, and she takes that as God telling her that he is her future husband. It doesn't have to be a minister - it happens from schools to churches, from businesses to chance meetings in public. Attraction to one's spirit is often mistaken as God's direction for a relationship. Mistaken - meaning it isn't God, it's just their spirit attracted to another's spirit.
When I was the director of a Bible school I got to know the great and widely respected evangelist, T.L. Osborn. Our school was in his ministry headquarters building, and I count that as a special time. He would speak at our chapel services, and I was even privileged to meet with him in his home. One day after he spoke at the chapel a student came to me crying, and she didn't know why. I asked her what she felt called to, and she said 'Missions.' I explained that the gifts in her spirit bore witness to the gifts in his spirit, missions, and her spirit was stirred upon hearing of all his adventures and the people he had won to the Lord. She knew T.L. according to Christ in each of them.
Another example:
When I was 16 I got to know a girl during 10th grade German class. The teacher often had students make teams of 2, and I was teamed with her. In between doing our lessons we got to know each other. She was Roman Catholic, I was Episcopalian (Anglican), which shares a common Sunday morning liturgy. She told me one day: "I know the God behind the liturgy." She led me to the Lord.
We were in 10th grade at the time, age 16. Her boyfriend and future husband led her to the Lord, she led me to the Lord, then I led my girlfriend and future wife, Barb, to the Lord. We each took a 2nd year of German in our junior year, so our friendship in the Lord continued to build. Our senior year of high school I was voted prom king, she was voted prom queen. I've always loved her spirit. I will always be thankful to her for sharing Jesus with me, and we are all still in regular touch to this day. I have loved her spirit since the start. I admire her soul and we have had that brother-sister relationship since. I would never, nor would she ever think of going beyond loving and appreciating our spirits.
But some people develop a friendship with someone at work, or a pastor with a worship leader, or 2 neighbors, and mistake attraction to one's spirit (or soul) as love, as God, as God's will, as God told me they are my mate....and it isn't that at all. It's just perceiving who they are in their spirit. A person will often become emotionally involved, say 'God told me' they are my husband/wife', and wonder why God didn't tell that other person. We are spirit, soul, and body. Don't cross the line. Perceive if you are attracted to that person's spirit, maybe spirit and soul...but if there are other boundaries already in place, don't cross them.
The idea our spirits can perceive what is in another's spirit isn't taught very much, and what is out there is pretty spooky and weird at times.
People perceive and are attracted to the qualities of another person's spirit, and mistake that attraction for love.
What if a pastor has a single woman in his congregation that comes to him, or him for advice. What if that pastor perceives in his spirit the qualities in the spirit of that woman - how God had made her, gifted her - and he feels an attraction to her because of that. Maybe she is also pretty to look at. He might manipulate her and control her, getting her to meet him at night alone at his office, or even bring s*x into the relationship under the guise that she needs that to be made whole from past relationships...and many other evil things like that happen in the body of Christ. Jesus defined adultery in Matthew 5: 28 as the imagination of lust towards another. Over the years I've seen many pastors in multiple adulteries - imaginations in their minds about women in their congregation or worship teams - and have pulled a few back from the brink.
This can happen in any business, industry, or friendships as well as church. Our world is so corrupt some suggest Mary Magdalene and Jesus were a couple - even early Christian heretical writings suggest that. People's minds are so corrupt they can't imagine a woman who had 7 demons cast out of her loving Jesus strictly on a spiritual level, they think it had to have gotten physical, but it didn't. Don't we love Jesus' from our spirit? That is purity. Our spirit bears witness with the Holy Spirit that we are the Father's children and that Christ is in us. This is why Paul writes in in I Timothy 5:2 to treat older women as mothers and younger ones as sisters - Paul is saying love their spirits, give them the respect and honor due, and don't cross boundaries.
Years ago I was a speaker at an 'apostolic' conference, and while waiting for my turn to speak in a side room, some of those helping serve water and snacks wanted to lay hands on me and prophesy over me. I let them, and what they initially said was spot on - that I would soon be launched into another type of ministry and such. But when I thanked them and started to get up from the 'hot seat', they urged me to sit back down 'and see what else the Lord might say.'
I did that, allowing them to continue. What they said next were things not of the Lord, but things their spirit perceived of the gifts in my spirit. Everything they said God would in the future bring me to, I was already doing. They didn't know at the time I was the Director of a large Bible school and taught classes nearly daily, oversaw a large staff in a mega-church, and filled in for the pastor on Sundays and Wednesday when he was traveling in ministry. Their 'prophetic words' which they all put in future tense, said I would soon be led to a position where I'd be teaching, soon be an administrator, soon oversee a large staff and budget....it was all the things I was currently doing. How did they miss it?
The first time they prayed was the Lord. The second was them perceiving in their spirit the things in my spirit - they were getting to know me as Paul stated above, by the spirit for the spirit is a new creation in Christ. Many so-called prophets build their ministry not on the prophetic, but on perceiving a person's spirit and turning it into a 'thus saith the Lord'. And we will start there next week. Until then, blessings,
John Fenn
cwowi.org and email me at [email protected]
There is great confusion about Seers, prophets, prophecy, personal prophecy. In this part 1 I'll share how we can know people by their spirit - and the troubles it can cause.
Attraction to one's spirit
"From this point on I will not know a person by man's standards, (but by the spirit), though we knew Christ once in the flesh, but no more, we know Him by the Spirit. For if anyone is in Christ he is a new creation. Old things are gone, behold, all things are new and all things are of God." II Corinthians 5: 16-17.
In the world we recognize or give honor or know a person according to the standards of the world: Education, economics, job held, wealth and so on. In Christ there is but one standard: Being born again. Earthly measurements of knowing someone are secondary, which is why Paul said from this point on he won't know a person according to worldly standards, but by the Spirit.
Much damage has been done by people confused about this New Testament reality of knowing people by their spirit. Many a woman has thrown herself at a minister because her spirit identifies with some of the gifts in his spirit, and she takes that as God telling her that he is her future husband. It doesn't have to be a minister - it happens from schools to churches, from businesses to chance meetings in public. Attraction to one's spirit is often mistaken as God's direction for a relationship. Mistaken - meaning it isn't God, it's just their spirit attracted to another's spirit.
When I was the director of a Bible school I got to know the great and widely respected evangelist, T.L. Osborn. Our school was in his ministry headquarters building, and I count that as a special time. He would speak at our chapel services, and I was even privileged to meet with him in his home. One day after he spoke at the chapel a student came to me crying, and she didn't know why. I asked her what she felt called to, and she said 'Missions.' I explained that the gifts in her spirit bore witness to the gifts in his spirit, missions, and her spirit was stirred upon hearing of all his adventures and the people he had won to the Lord. She knew T.L. according to Christ in each of them.
Another example:
When I was 16 I got to know a girl during 10th grade German class. The teacher often had students make teams of 2, and I was teamed with her. In between doing our lessons we got to know each other. She was Roman Catholic, I was Episcopalian (Anglican), which shares a common Sunday morning liturgy. She told me one day: "I know the God behind the liturgy." She led me to the Lord.
We were in 10th grade at the time, age 16. Her boyfriend and future husband led her to the Lord, she led me to the Lord, then I led my girlfriend and future wife, Barb, to the Lord. We each took a 2nd year of German in our junior year, so our friendship in the Lord continued to build. Our senior year of high school I was voted prom king, she was voted prom queen. I've always loved her spirit. I will always be thankful to her for sharing Jesus with me, and we are all still in regular touch to this day. I have loved her spirit since the start. I admire her soul and we have had that brother-sister relationship since. I would never, nor would she ever think of going beyond loving and appreciating our spirits.
But some people develop a friendship with someone at work, or a pastor with a worship leader, or 2 neighbors, and mistake attraction to one's spirit (or soul) as love, as God, as God's will, as God told me they are my mate....and it isn't that at all. It's just perceiving who they are in their spirit. A person will often become emotionally involved, say 'God told me' they are my husband/wife', and wonder why God didn't tell that other person. We are spirit, soul, and body. Don't cross the line. Perceive if you are attracted to that person's spirit, maybe spirit and soul...but if there are other boundaries already in place, don't cross them.
The idea our spirits can perceive what is in another's spirit isn't taught very much, and what is out there is pretty spooky and weird at times.
People perceive and are attracted to the qualities of another person's spirit, and mistake that attraction for love.
What if a pastor has a single woman in his congregation that comes to him, or him for advice. What if that pastor perceives in his spirit the qualities in the spirit of that woman - how God had made her, gifted her - and he feels an attraction to her because of that. Maybe she is also pretty to look at. He might manipulate her and control her, getting her to meet him at night alone at his office, or even bring s*x into the relationship under the guise that she needs that to be made whole from past relationships...and many other evil things like that happen in the body of Christ. Jesus defined adultery in Matthew 5: 28 as the imagination of lust towards another. Over the years I've seen many pastors in multiple adulteries - imaginations in their minds about women in their congregation or worship teams - and have pulled a few back from the brink.
This can happen in any business, industry, or friendships as well as church. Our world is so corrupt some suggest Mary Magdalene and Jesus were a couple - even early Christian heretical writings suggest that. People's minds are so corrupt they can't imagine a woman who had 7 demons cast out of her loving Jesus strictly on a spiritual level, they think it had to have gotten physical, but it didn't. Don't we love Jesus' from our spirit? That is purity. Our spirit bears witness with the Holy Spirit that we are the Father's children and that Christ is in us. This is why Paul writes in in I Timothy 5:2 to treat older women as mothers and younger ones as sisters - Paul is saying love their spirits, give them the respect and honor due, and don't cross boundaries.
Years ago I was a speaker at an 'apostolic' conference, and while waiting for my turn to speak in a side room, some of those helping serve water and snacks wanted to lay hands on me and prophesy over me. I let them, and what they initially said was spot on - that I would soon be launched into another type of ministry and such. But when I thanked them and started to get up from the 'hot seat', they urged me to sit back down 'and see what else the Lord might say.'
I did that, allowing them to continue. What they said next were things not of the Lord, but things their spirit perceived of the gifts in my spirit. Everything they said God would in the future bring me to, I was already doing. They didn't know at the time I was the Director of a large Bible school and taught classes nearly daily, oversaw a large staff in a mega-church, and filled in for the pastor on Sundays and Wednesday when he was traveling in ministry. Their 'prophetic words' which they all put in future tense, said I would soon be led to a position where I'd be teaching, soon be an administrator, soon oversee a large staff and budget....it was all the things I was currently doing. How did they miss it?
The first time they prayed was the Lord. The second was them perceiving in their spirit the things in my spirit - they were getting to know me as Paul stated above, by the spirit for the spirit is a new creation in Christ. Many so-called prophets build their ministry not on the prophetic, but on perceiving a person's spirit and turning it into a 'thus saith the Lord'. And we will start there next week. Until then, blessings,
John Fenn
cwowi.org and email me at [email protected]
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